Primer Seating Issues
Quote from Reloader on December 30, 2020, 1:07 pmOK, I’m loading pre-sized/decapped 223/5.56 cases on my 650, and am experiencing some primer seating issues….mainly the primer not seating smoothly.
The issue was first present with military cases. All the military cases were run through a Dillon swagger, but I couldn’t confirm it completely removed the primer pocket crimp. The primers “clipped” the side of the pocket about 40% of the time, often severely, and ended up seated sideways on another 10%.
I checked the shell plate, and it had no wobble or dirt in the case rim slots. The primer ram looked to be centered in the shell plate opening, and the shell plate snapped into place crisply. The primer assembly spring finger seemed to position the case properly, fully into the shell plate opening. I do have a roller bearing assembly between the shell plate and shell plate bolt head.
To better assure the primer pocket crimp was removed, I used a Hornady crimp remover cutter. This seemed to eliminate about 50% of my severe primer seating “clipping” issues, and most of the primer sideways issues.
After suffering through the remaining military cases, I switched to some commercial Federal cases. Still had some primer seating “clipping” issues, but not as severe as with the military cases.
It seems that if I pause a second or so prior to seating the primer, it seems to seat easier. I bring the platform to its “rested” position, and watch the case in the bullet seating position; when it stops wobbling, I press forward and seat the primer without problem or just minor “clipping”. That said, there are rare occasions where I need to rotate the case being primed to avoid severe “clipping”.
Any thoughts on what could be my problem? I’d like to eliminate the military case primer seating issues, and be able to load commercial cases without pausing.
FYI, I’ve been using the CCI 450 Small Rifle Magnum primers….didn’t know if anyone has experienced seating issues with a specific brand/type.
Thank you! Mike
OK, I’m loading pre-sized/decapped 223/5.56 cases on my 650, and am experiencing some primer seating issues….mainly the primer not seating smoothly.
The issue was first present with military cases. All the military cases were run through a Dillon swagger, but I couldn’t confirm it completely removed the primer pocket crimp. The primers “clipped” the side of the pocket about 40% of the time, often severely, and ended up seated sideways on another 10%.
I checked the shell plate, and it had no wobble or dirt in the case rim slots. The primer ram looked to be centered in the shell plate opening, and the shell plate snapped into place crisply. The primer assembly spring finger seemed to position the case properly, fully into the shell plate opening. I do have a roller bearing assembly between the shell plate and shell plate bolt head.
To better assure the primer pocket crimp was removed, I used a Hornady crimp remover cutter. This seemed to eliminate about 50% of my severe primer seating “clipping” issues, and most of the primer sideways issues.
After suffering through the remaining military cases, I switched to some commercial Federal cases. Still had some primer seating “clipping” issues, but not as severe as with the military cases.
It seems that if I pause a second or so prior to seating the primer, it seems to seat easier. I bring the platform to its “rested” position, and watch the case in the bullet seating position; when it stops wobbling, I press forward and seat the primer without problem or just minor “clipping”. That said, there are rare occasions where I need to rotate the case being primed to avoid severe “clipping”.
Any thoughts on what could be my problem? I’d like to eliminate the military case primer seating issues, and be able to load commercial cases without pausing.
FYI, I’ve been using the CCI 450 Small Rifle Magnum primers….didn’t know if anyone has experienced seating issues with a specific brand/type.
Thank you! Mike
Quote from Reloader on December 30, 2020, 2:19 pmOccasionally I have your problem with 9mm pistol cartridges and small primer .45 cartridges. As a remedy, I countersink the primer pocket just a small amount with either a hand chamfering tool or a drill press with an appropriate drill bit. Once countersinking is done to a case, the case can be primed over and over with no problem.
Occasionally I have your problem with 9mm pistol cartridges and small primer .45 cartridges. As a remedy, I countersink the primer pocket just a small amount with either a hand chamfering tool or a drill press with an appropriate drill bit. Once countersinking is done to a case, the case can be primed over and over with no problem.
Quote from Reloader on December 31, 2020, 1:25 pmThanks! That is what I’d hoped to accomplish with the Hornady cutter. Since the issue, to a much lesser degree, is also present with commercial cases, I was hoping I may have overlooked a press adjustment or something else.
Mike
Thanks! That is what I’d hoped to accomplish with the Hornady cutter. Since the issue, to a much lesser degree, is also present with commercial cases, I was hoping I may have overlooked a press adjustment or something else.
Mike
Quote from Jimmyhat1978 on June 14, 2023, 8:20 pmThis happened to me recently as well on 3 out of 100, same caliber .223/5.56.
I'll try slowing down and maybe pay more attention at the case prep table when removing crimps.
This happened to me recently as well on 3 out of 100, same caliber .223/5.56.
I'll try slowing down and maybe pay more attention at the case prep table when removing crimps.
Quote from rorkplumbing on June 14, 2023, 8:42 pmI did experience this once in a while in the beginning but have not had the problem for a long while now. I now de-prime my cases separately on a single stage and then swage them. I then clean the cases and run them on a crimp cutter and primer pocket cleaner on a machine. Then I load them on my 650. I know it seems like a lot of steps, but I am almost retired and have the time. I do mark the cases and just clean the primer pockets on the next load.
I don't think it's a big deal, but I don't use magnum primers for my military 5.56mm. I know after the big primer shortages we all learned that we could use all kinds of primers due to availability, so I guess as I write this, I don't think that is the cause.
Good Luck,
Jay
I did experience this once in a while in the beginning but have not had the problem for a long while now. I now de-prime my cases separately on a single stage and then swage them. I then clean the cases and run them on a crimp cutter and primer pocket cleaner on a machine. Then I load them on my 650. I know it seems like a lot of steps, but I am almost retired and have the time. I do mark the cases and just clean the primer pockets on the next load.
I don't think it's a big deal, but I don't use magnum primers for my military 5.56mm. I know after the big primer shortages we all learned that we could use all kinds of primers due to availability, so I guess as I write this, I don't think that is the cause.
Good Luck,
Jay
Quote from Jimmyhat1978 on June 14, 2023, 8:47 pmThat's exactly what I do as well, I don't have anything in my stage 1 tool head when reloading.
I clean, then decap and size, do my pocket cleaning, trimming and then finally clean again. I only do about 50 or 100 at a time.
That's exactly what I do as well, I don't have anything in my stage 1 tool head when reloading.
I clean, then decap and size, do my pocket cleaning, trimming and then finally clean again. I only do about 50 or 100 at a time.
Quote from Cewebb on June 14, 2023, 9:32 pmI had similar issues with all calibers I loaded in my XL650. It turned out to be that the Indexer Block needed to be adjusted so the shell plate indexed into position a little sooner. What was happening was the shell plate was not fully rotated into position when the RAM started lowering to seat the primer causing the edge of the primer hit the edge of the primer hole. This caused the primer to rotate and seat sideways or just seat hard. If I stopped the ram before seating the primer or slowed the ram approached the neutral point before seating the primer, the issue went away.
Good Luck...
I had similar issues with all calibers I loaded in my XL650. It turned out to be that the Indexer Block needed to be adjusted so the shell plate indexed into position a little sooner. What was happening was the shell plate was not fully rotated into position when the RAM started lowering to seat the primer causing the edge of the primer hit the edge of the primer hole. This caused the primer to rotate and seat sideways or just seat hard. If I stopped the ram before seating the primer or slowed the ram approached the neutral point before seating the primer, the issue went away.
Good Luck...
Quote from TR1Hemi on June 16, 2023, 12:52 amAfter several thousand reloads I have finally matured to quality vs quantity. First off I hate the 650 primer setup, but I have a 650. This solution also took care of the powder all over the place issue.
I have one tool head with all my deprime and resize dies. I rotate the dies according to what I am working with. I pick up range brass after a session, whatever is out there and handy. First I sort and vibrator clean the brass and do the visual inspection thing. Then I do a light lube and deprime / resize everything.
After depriming I run all the brass through a wet with steel pin cleaning. Btw, your Nesco dehydrator works just as well and a purpose bought brass dryer.
I now have spotless brass with clean primer pockets. I purchased a Lee automatic case primer press and mounted it just on the right side of the 650 and feed the cases with a jury rig off the case feeder.
What this has bought me is a much more consistent primer seat, clean brass already sized with new primers.
AND a very smooth running 650 with out the jarring of depriming and resizing as well as the issue of dismantling the priming system every time a primer hangs up.
The other advantage is that I also shoot 10mm and 45acp. Brass that is now sometimes large primer and sometimes small primer. If I want to load either, I don't have to switch the Dillon priming system to large or small. I don't like the idea of throwing half the brass away because …
Oh, and others have said, when the 650 isn't running right, the machine is dirty.
After several thousand reloads I have finally matured to quality vs quantity. First off I hate the 650 primer setup, but I have a 650. This solution also took care of the powder all over the place issue.
I have one tool head with all my deprime and resize dies. I rotate the dies according to what I am working with. I pick up range brass after a session, whatever is out there and handy. First I sort and vibrator clean the brass and do the visual inspection thing. Then I do a light lube and deprime / resize everything.
After depriming I run all the brass through a wet with steel pin cleaning. Btw, your Nesco dehydrator works just as well and a purpose bought brass dryer.
I now have spotless brass with clean primer pockets. I purchased a Lee automatic case primer press and mounted it just on the right side of the 650 and feed the cases with a jury rig off the case feeder.
What this has bought me is a much more consistent primer seat, clean brass already sized with new primers.
AND a very smooth running 650 with out the jarring of depriming and resizing as well as the issue of dismantling the priming system every time a primer hangs up.
The other advantage is that I also shoot 10mm and 45acp. Brass that is now sometimes large primer and sometimes small primer. If I want to load either, I don't have to switch the Dillon priming system to large or small. I don't like the idea of throwing half the brass away because …
Oh, and others have said, when the 650 isn't running right, the machine is dirty.
Quote from Jetcop20 on June 16, 2023, 7:19 pmI had a similar issue with my 650 mine was crushing primers and flipping them on the side
so what I did was take both primer disks and on both sides just take a countersink bit and touch the holes a small amount of pressure to remove the stamp burr on all the holes on both sides that problem should disappear
I had a similar issue with my 650 mine was crushing primers and flipping them on the side
so what I did was take both primer disks and on both sides just take a countersink bit and touch the holes a small amount of pressure to remove the stamp burr on all the holes on both sides that problem should disappear